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 Game > Updates & Changes 
stephen
2009-10-18
  Balance - System Defense  

Decimal system added to system defense
*Summary


Important Notes

1. This has been requested by a number of players.

2. Post constructive comments. If you dont like the change explain with great detail and if possible some calculation/math behind it.

3. Please keep this discussion civil and related, changes may be made depending on this discussion

4. Immediate -2 days no turn if you are in anyway *uncivil, no appeals will be entertained



2009-10-18

We have adjusted the stack spam penalty, thanks to your help.

Now
stack1 > 90% ship pr ; -60%
stack1 > 80% ship pr ; -50%
stack1 > 70% ship pr ; -40%
stack1 > 60% ship pr ; -30%
stack1 > 50% ship pr ; -25%
stack1 > 40% ship pr ; -20%

Before
stack1 > 90% ship pr ; -50%
stack1 > 80% ship pr ; -40%
stack1 > 70% ship pr ; -30%
stack1 > 60% ship pr ; -26%
stack1 > 50% ship pr ; -24%
stack1 > 40% ship pr ; -22%

Note: Stack spam penalty only effects the 1st stack (the spam)

Current list of potential issues:
* Stack Spam (addressed)
* Low rank suiciders (addressed)
* Effects on slower speed servers


2009-10-15

A number of players has highlighted that something should be done to reduce suiciders and stack-spammers in relation to the -SD effect. I am looking at it, int he mean time please feel free to post your ideas/suggestions, this will greatly help speed up the process of us rectifying this.

Btw it takes way too long for me+admin to sort out useful ideas from junk, therefore i have removed non-related post & whine. i would like to thank `Zyxdo, morebtcspls, GhostofJ, SilentDeath, Vigi` for highlighting a couple of potential problems

Thanks to the feedback from players, we have updated the attacking rules:

* Suicide will no longer qualify for attack bonus (ex: attack bonus is given if you are attacking someone stronger)
* Suicide (weapon bonus) | now: attacker +110%, defender +140% . . | . . before: attacker +100%, defender +120%
* Retal (weapon bonus) | now: attacker +10%, defender 0% . . | . . before: attacker +0%, defender +5%
* Planet tax reduced by 10% (from 20 points to 18 points )


2009-10-14

This is with immediate effect

Decimal Point

We have added a decimal point system to our planetary SD (system defense). As you all know, the planetary system levels would be better balanced IF there were a decimal point involved. For instance, we have made it so that SD increase by 0.1 per lvl for Sol systems. This allows us to move SD gradually rather than `bouncing`.

Example:
Non-Decimal: 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2
Decimal: 1.2, 1.4, 1.6, 1.8, 2, 2.2

In theory this would allow us to better balance the planetary levels and to give it more incen
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Azmah
99+ day(s) ago
It has been one week since this update has hit daily and over 50% of my targets have now VMed after hits on them. Daily is dieing again.. high PR is mostly my own fed! Its getting ridiculous now!
pledge2
99+ day(s) ago
give hourly something unique there so ppl actually want to come and play there... no clue to what to do but something needs done there it used to be awesome there now its died off so fast its crazy just like a year and a half ago it was pretty good now its dead.. :(
DragoKrazov
99+ day(s) ago
current dp times is good enuff...
permanent dummies is not needed
Solace
99+ day(s) ago
True GhostJ

But the changes are designed in a way to encourage attacking
and hopefully more stacking attacking
A person may need 2 main suiy to get 2 wins = 4 retals

Another idea, the general flow of planets is from low emps up through the prs

Change SP`s rather than you must be level 16 for SP 5
make it

Must be below level 15 for SP 5
Below level 12 for SP 4
Below level 10 for SP 3
SP 1 and 2 for everyone

Help the lower emps and keep them interested in the game
GhostofJ
99+ day(s) ago
fear of retals isnt necessarily a bad thing. it would discourage people from randomly invading outers to gain planets because they`d just lose many many more on the retal :P u`d have to actually learn how to defend urself as well as make every single attack count so u dont hand out too many retals. also, it could put a bit of strategy in. u wouldnt be able to just attack everyone all day long everyday because u`ll get retal`d to hell and back :P so u`d want to have an attack spree and than maybe lay low for awhile :P either way, point is fear of retals isnt necessarily a bad thing :P
Solace
99+ day(s) ago
Agrees with Crale
And a solution is going to be hard to come by
Longer Dp times
Increase Sp`s to help lower emps
remove suicides to outters
increase SD for first 3 outters
Permenant dummy ships on first 3 outters that can`t be killed

Who knows hopefully the game pros can come up with something for the slower speeds

Az as with life changing 1 thing benefits 1 thing but hurts another

My concern is , is a pr gap going to be created between those that can operate above the 150% or 4 bil max and those that can`t
I would not mind 3 op stacks if a person can only attack from less than 100% above
but what about the low emps
a balanced stack with 4 retals from 250% on 3 op stacks hmmmm
would this reduce attacking due to fear of retals
Crale
99+ day(s) ago
And don`t even try to bring up that "it happens to everyone" speech. Hourly is a special case, it literally happens to everyone all the time. I know OP often gets wiped on RT and Daily, but lots of the time it`s preventable(less so on Daily than RT). In hourly... It`s NOT preventable at all, unless you get someone to DP your fed which is CHEATING. There simply aren`t outer hitters like there are on RT, the only ones we really see are suiciding our outers to wipe OP, or spamming mains the odd time. Few do hit outers, but within the 32 hour DP span, having an entire fed out kinda indicates that not much hitting is being done :P
Crale
99+ day(s) ago
Thibor the change to spam that has been made already is great, no need to further adjust right now. It makes dual spams better(yay), and hinders those annoying mono spammers. Too many people just throwing mono queen or runner spams out there, and it doesn`t even take any skill.. You just need the turns and cash and instructions from someone(if it were a complete newb doing the attacking), and you could then just use that on everyone. At least, on daily and hourly you could -- as most everyone camps(what do you expect and a less active server with 10b pr cap :P).

Oh, and as far as hourly goes, it could probably use some revamping or something.. There are very few people who attack, so the top 2~3 feds end up having groups of their members expire at once, sometimes it ends up being the entire fed.

Hourly isn`t for insanely active people like RT, and many of us(not that hourly has many people) can`t exactly stay online all day to make sure OP is alright, and therefore it constantly gets wiped. Even I have exploited this off other feds -- wiping op the first few hits and then winning more attacks on mains than I needed to wipe op on outers. It`s not my preferred method, but hey... Everyone was doing it to my fed. I`m not going to sign a petition to fix the problem which may never happen, so I just started doing it back :P.

I honestly don`t know if there`s a good fix out there for this, but perhaps longer dp times might be one solution.

Another I thought of would be to decrease the amount of OP stacks each player receives, or negate OP completely, and just provide a world SD increase. This would be a change in a grand scale, and SD would have to increase a fair amount to provide protection from spammers if we had fewer/no flankers, but this is also something that could revitalize the flavor hourly once had during some of it`s more active times.
phantom
99+ day(s) ago
Yes, 3 stacks from anywhere, either all 3 from fed, or 2 from fed and 1 from lord/vassal.
Highest stack comes first :)
DragoKrazov
99+ day(s) ago
the games itself is full of probabilities... it cant be perfect..

spam may win on stack
stack may win on spam
stack may win on stack
spam may win on spam
DragoKrazov
99+ day(s) ago
but then where the fun of it???
DragoKrazov
99+ day(s) ago
waa thibor... why nerf spam?? u cant forced people to go stacking....

some prefer stack, some prefer spam... some can do both...

if u still want stack get good boost n nerf spam....

stack1 > 90% ship pr ; -99%
stack1 > 80% ship pr ; -99%
stack1 > 70% ship pr ; -99%
stack1 > 60% ship pr ; -99%
stack1 > 50% ship pr ; -99%
stack1 > 40% ship pr ; -99%

n max op only 2 from fed/lord/vassal...

coz i prefer the current spam penalty is good...
Thibor
99+ day(s) ago
my opinion on the stopping 99% of the spammers out their take away their mini options if you spam your mini becomes useless in many ways not sure if this can be done but would be cool if it can be if not i would change the stack ratios to
Now
stack1 > 90% ship pr ; -90%
stack1 > 80% ship pr ; -80%
stack1 > 70% ship pr ; -80%
stack1 > 60% ship pr ; -80%
stack1 > 50% ship pr ; -40%
stack1 > 40% ship pr ; -40%
it would discourage anyone who tries to spam
GhostofJ
99+ day(s) ago
ya 3 max from wherever would be best and would probably take the least work lol the system could still find the biggest 4 stacks, and just remove the lowest 1 of those 4 lol
Azmah
99+ day(s) ago
And i 100% agree with solace comment about UWs although this isn`t the place for it, but can`t really blame a player trying to grab stephens attention on a matter thats pretty much been ignored for a good while.
Azmah
99+ day(s) ago
@Solace, this has an effect on me and my fed too :P, of course i love a challenge, but in some ways 3 stacks can be better than 4 in a fed :P, if you only need 3 to survive, is it not better for you for a maximum of 3 stacks to be killed at a time instead of 4?

All my targets are going into VM since update so i haven`t got much to do atm.. They didn`t like losing too often, update made it quite a bit easier to lose here on daily far bigger effect than it had on RT. Only people staying out are my fed and people with either big OPs that can`t be killed on others or many empires outside of OP range posting for a fed. And i guess the low PR people but i don`t much about what goes on below 2B.
DragoKrazov
99+ day(s) ago
current spam penalty is good enough
SilentDeath
99+ day(s) ago
steph i don`t think everyone checks forums . so if u want a mass update u would get better results on that polls page:)
phantom
99+ day(s) ago
3 from fed. none from lord/ vassal.
SacramentOfTheWild
99+ day(s) ago
Argh I need to stop reposting.

@Stephen: giving the defender an extra 20% doesn`t really help the low ranges though, since they still will most likely lose their entire fleet to a newbcider (since the sui will have a mini but the new player most likely will not). What I was thinking as have many people is that suicide just can`t be an option under 100 mil pr or until you have 500k planets or something, which eliminates this problem of these newbciders keeping new players from getting started just for some kind of an ego kick (thats really all it is... there is no valid point for doing that after you have your systems Xd out).

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